offline calvin_0 Guru  
Monday 12/07/2010, 12:28

So to tell the truth, i'm still quite new to UR, i didnt play much because i cant play most of the time, i find UR quite fun.

this is my deck.

Lv. 5 Avola
Lv. 4 Rosa
Lv. 3 Mona
Lv. 3 Sharon
Lv. 3 Ottavia
Lv. 3 Oscar
Lv. 2 Prince Jr
Lv. 2 Spiaghi

to tell the truth, i dont really know what my deck are capable, i just put them together because i just like some of the art (Avola, Rosa, Mona, Sharon and Ottavia). the rest are what people told me are "good" cards (Prince Jr, Spiaghi and Oscar).

the problem i always have is i have no idea what to do in round 1, i offen use Rosa with one pill, it work great in 15-20 rooms, people always put thier SOA or large amount of pill, but it doesnt work in Elo (maybe i'm facing better player?)

i also often let 2 rounds pass, work great with room 15-20, but its doesnt work in Elo because i always open myself to 2hit-ok, i learn that the hard way.

so can anyone give me some advice in opening (round 1 and 2) and bluffing (i have no idea what other potential bluff card that i can use other then Rosa), i know i can learn that by playing, but i just want some pointer to get started, I also have trouble facing other Montana, Upper, Sakrohm and Pill manipulation deck.


PS: i have Don and Edd in case i really have to do what most people told me too, swap Avola and Rosa for Don and Edd.

offline UmExcuseMe Imperator  
Monday 12/07/2010, 19:42

I'm not a big fan of Rosa. She takes up a lot of room at 4*, and with 6 power she's hard to get through. Too many things blunt her effectiveness, like SOA, SOB and even DR (poison of 1 isn't much). I think the general consensus is that Edd is superior.

This deck plays differently depending on whether you draw Avola. If you do, the 2-hit KO becomes a definite factor. Option 1: open with Oscar or Edd (or anyone other than Spiaghi, really) with 3-5 pillz, hoping it gets through, and you'll have 3 rounds to decide when to all-pill Avola for the KO. Option 2: open with Oscar or Edd with 1 or 2 pillz (bluff), hoping your opponent overpills, then wipe him out with Avola at your leisure.

It gets trickier without Avola, because the rest of your deck is a bit light on damage. Don't bother with 2HKO (no, not even with Sharon and Edd), you need to arrange it so that your opponent's big damage cards are either blocked by DR (Ottavia, Spiaghi) or overpowered (Oscar, Edd, Mona). Edd with 1-3 pillz is a common first move, but depending on your opponent's hand you could lead with Sharon, Prince Jr, Ottavia or even Spiaghi. Use that -12 opp attack to your advantage, and you're likely to emerge victorious after 4 rounds.

BTW, if you keep getting 2HKO'ed, why not dangle some bait? Bluff round 1, then put in enough pillz to stop the 2HKO round 2.

And yes, Uppers, Sakrohm and pill manipulation (especially Piranas) give Montana a harder than usual time, but the same principles apply.

offline 0 Pride Imperator URBAN MADNESS
Tuesday 13/07/2010, 03:41

Rosa to donnie
or maybe ottavia to oscar

offline calvin_0 Guru  
Saturday 17/07/2010, 09:59

Thanks, UmExcuseMe. i change Rosa to Edd and he is very useful, although he is predictable, but the SOB come in handy when facing opponent' SOB (like Nightmare)

and thanks for the advice on how to avoid 2HKO, but the problem i face lately is my opponent seems to able to tell when i bluff, like i bluff in round one, Sharon with 1 pills, opponent often put like 2-3 pills to stop it and make a hole in my life for 2HKO. in round 2 with almost equal in pill, i have no idea what to do in the next round.

any advice in the situation like that?

offline Fanta Pants Guru TRiNiTY
Saturday 17/07/2010, 10:14

Allways assume it's a bluff imo because you are worse off with no pillz than when hit with some damage

offline 1mannARMEE Titan  
Saturday 17/07/2010, 13:08

UmExcuseMe is absolutly right, it really depends on Avola

during normal draws you have to win at least two rounds, because Montana has difficulties with their relativly low damage and power to overwhelm an opponent in only two rounds (a well placed Spiaghi helps though)

you should really switch Rosa to Edd, because Edd ensures 5 damage most of the time, even when bluffed against other attack manipulation clans (they just say to themselves, okay 7 power - 12 attack it's not worth to pill against that) so you really get an edge over Sakrohm / Uppers and especially Nightmares and Piranhas (the latter aren't used to play against bonuses smiley )

if you have to play first (meaning you have the hand with the higher star count) you have to be aware that your opponent will know 3 out of your 4 cards, first round, third and fourth round will be obvious to him => it's way easier to predict bluffs this way and if you are already in the two hit zone after the first round it will be nearly impossible with an average draw of low damage Montanas to prevent yourself from loosing !

You should try to pressure your opponent earlier imho, if you have to play first, try to win the first round (if they don't have nasty damage reduction) this way it might be obvious to your opponent what you are going to play the last two rounds, but he has to be aware of the second round and he will never know which of the two last rounds he has to win to survive the match (except if you leave your Spiaghi)

offline UmExcuseMe Imperator  
Saturday 17/07/2010, 14:14

@calvin: It's always possible that your opp reads your bluff, but this generally means that you have a 1-2 pill advantage. so you can still pill enough to stop 2HKO. Yes, even if it leaves you with only 1-2 pillz, because that's usually enough when your opp has zero pillz especially for Montana.

Knowing what's the right play comes down to experience, instinct and luck. For example, take note of the type of situations when your opp answers a first round Sharon with 2-3 pillz. I find that if my opp has a 2HKO opportunity, then they are more likely to toss 2-4 pillz in response to Sharon. This is because if they win, they have most of their pillz for the kill, but if they lose, they still have enough life to survive anything but Avola or a furied Edd. Knowing this, I sometimes play Sharon with 2-4 pillz (or even 5-6) to get that 5 damage through.

Keep trying, experiment, and be patient. Eventually you will learn your deck well enough that you will notice an appreciable improvement in your results. Also, there is no perfect formula, it depends a lot on your personal style. For instance, I don't subscribe to the view that winning the first round is any more important than winning any other round (except for special cases like poison) because I am perfectly happy to take a big life hit early for a decent pillz advantage. Others prefer to threaten KO after round 1 whenever possible.

offline Yippers Master  
Saturday 17/07/2010, 15:21

I usually call opponents on their bluffs when they throw down obviously weaker cards, ones that lack 2HKO options with the rest of their hand or has less handy effects to penetrate through (like leader cards).

When I bluff on the first round, it's usually with a dangerous card that forces 5-6 pillz from my opponent and only when he doesn't have easy 2HKOs if he calls it. And even if I do, I make sure the card's attack is high enough (by attack manipulation or via adding 1-2 pillz) to counter threats. Don’t always assume that the opponent realizes Sharon is your 2 most damaging card in your hand.

Case 1: Your first round; opponent has Copper or Caelus, etc.
Don't start with somebody like Sharon. He knows that his card can defeat her cheaply, and that dent into your health is going to force you to assume he's not bluffing and waste your pillz advantage. A better idea: Damage reduction like Spiaghi could be put down first round, to cancel one or two possible 2HKOs even if it gets through. Moreover, he's not going to expect you to add pillz to a card with 1 damage; surprise him and waste one of his cards entirely.

Case 2: Your first round; opponent has a fairly dangerous thing (like 7-6 power, 6-8 damage).
Power reducers and DR will scare them off, forcing them to overpillz or not throwing down their champion to counter.

offline Yippers Master  
Saturday 17/07/2010, 15:22

Case 3: Your first round; opponent has multiple dangerous things.
He's probably going to use pillz on one of them to counter whatever you throw down just to get access to the 2HKO finisher. If you have a not imposing card like Sharon out, he's going to feel confident and pill up (I assume 3-6 pillz). Add enough to compensate and leave a 5 damage hole.

Case 4: Opponent called your bluff.
And has a chunky health advantage at the cost of a slight pillz disadvantage. Depending on the remaining cards, you may have lost. In his next turn, he’ll most likely play a card who can 2HKO (or that can sneak in one with fury). If that card+pillz beats all of your cards, you lost. If not, you have to call whether he’s going to finish or not. Look at his other cards, can he finish with those and if so, do you have enough pillz to block 2 potential finishers? Look at his player level compared to yours, is he inexperienced or overly confident in his experience? If you call his bluff, can you 2HKO him with the pillz advantage -- and is he experience enough to understand this? Make a judgement call. Remember that if he is bluffing, get enough attack to block 0-1 pillz.

offline Yippers Master  
Saturday 17/07/2010, 15:22

Case 4-1: Opponent bluffed, and you called it correctly.
If you’re ahead on pillz and can finish, that’s game. If not, you’re now on the other side of the bluff-calling. Does he have a second 2HKO? Can he sit on his cards and fury you if you waste all your pillz? Do some quick math: if you sent forth a card with enough pillz, which one would he pick to counter it? Would you have enough pillz leftover to win with the other card? Also, note that winning a battle doesn’t always mean reducing his heath to 0. And remember that he’s nervous now too.

Hope that helped smiley

Answer to this subject

Clint City, night.