Current ELO vs ELO in the past - invitation for comments
Current ELO vs ELO in the past - invitation for comments
Sunday 18/11/2012, 03:06
wasteroftime - Moderator 
6 messages
Current ELO vs ELO in the past - invitation for comments 
wasteroftime - Moderator - Open Casket - Sunday 18/11/2012, 03:06
wasteroftime - Moderator - Open Casket
- Sunday 18/11/2012, 03:06This is a thread asking players who have played ELO format for a long time (several years), through all the different changes it has taken, to comment on how the format has changed.
I invite you to follow the format below when making your comments
PRO -
CONs -
the relationship between luck-skill-and card/deck
I invite you to follow the format below when making your comments
PRO -
CONs -
the relationship between luck-skill-and card/deck
2/6
Ill start off
i will also ask you to add start date (this will give us an idea of the amount of changes you''ve played through)
Start date - Monday 10/11/08
PROs-
1) card variety, with more cards out there the more options there are when making decks. All clans are now playable in half decks and most clans can run mono (although encouraging more mono play is bad at times i think).
2)weekly card bans are superior to the whole clan bans of the past
CONs
1) too many really good cards make the game more of a guessing game at times
2) power creep
3) 14 life i think is actually a bad thing since it turned the game into a life gapping contest.... old old for 2 or 3 rounds is now a decent tactic whereas olding in the past meant you had to be willing to risk getting KOd. 13 life might be a nice experiment
4) 1st round is too decisive too often. in the past, 1st round was more often a feeling out process that gained you a small advantage if you won.
LUCK, SKILL, CARDS/DECK -
all 3 have always been important.
more cards now makes for some more variety but certain card combos are deadly especially when the opponent does not draw appropriate counter cards (i say cards, since dancing around one counter card can be done easily enough)
the importance of luck has increase
skill is still important, however, a big discrepancy in skill is now more easily overcomed with a good hand.
edited by wasteroftime Sunday 18/11/2012, 03:23
i will also ask you to add start date (this will give us an idea of the amount of changes you''ve played through)
Start date - Monday 10/11/08
PROs-
1) card variety, with more cards out there the more options there are when making decks. All clans are now playable in half decks and most clans can run mono (although encouraging more mono play is bad at times i think).
2)weekly card bans are superior to the whole clan bans of the past
CONs
1) too many really good cards make the game more of a guessing game at times
2) power creep
3) 14 life i think is actually a bad thing since it turned the game into a life gapping contest.... old old for 2 or 3 rounds is now a decent tactic whereas olding in the past meant you had to be willing to risk getting KOd. 13 life might be a nice experiment
4) 1st round is too decisive too often. in the past, 1st round was more often a feeling out process that gained you a small advantage if you won.
LUCK, SKILL, CARDS/DECK -
all 3 have always been important.
more cards now makes for some more variety but certain card combos are deadly especially when the opponent does not draw appropriate counter cards (i say cards, since dancing around one counter card can be done easily enough)
the importance of luck has increase
skill is still important, however, a big discrepancy in skill is now more easily overcomed with a good hand.
edited by wasteroftime Sunday 18/11/2012, 03:23
3/6
Start date - Sunday 08/10/06
Pros (of the current ELO?)-
1) Yes, more cards + more clans = more variety.
2) Cheap decks are also ELO viable/friendly. ELO was a high-class society with only those with high-end cards like Jackie Cr, Zatman, Graks etc making decent top scores. As well as banning the use of filler/undeveloped cards such as Charlie @ 4* or Wanda @ 1* etc
3) The metagame shifts regularly as compared to older days (but i guess the current elo is getting stagnant with 3-4 clans being the obvious choices).
4) No random mode (I have doubts about this, I know normal matches were all set in random mode but was it also for ELO? Clarify this please)
5) Better ELO bans + Format election (power to the public)
6) Much bigger fan base = better players = better input = better output
7) Quick battle mode, making cheating in ELO much harder.
Cons -
1) Better-than-the-last-release mantra have driven most older cards/clans obsolete. for eg. the All Stars, with all the power creep(?) the only viable "fixed" choices are Saki, Robb Cr(?), Karen, Marina, Stacey/Jessie (does anybody pick anything else? even Randy gets no facetime these days). The same goes for the PCs with Clover, Diana, Lucy + 1 random other card becoming the norm.
TLDR : While the no. of cards and clans have grown exponentially, the case still remains the same - players will pick from the obvious chosen lot of 5-6 from the 20+ other cards in the clan. Mono-decks are a different story.
(contd...)
Pros (of the current ELO?)-
1) Yes, more cards + more clans = more variety.
2) Cheap decks are also ELO viable/friendly. ELO was a high-class society with only those with high-end cards like Jackie Cr, Zatman, Graks etc making decent top scores. As well as banning the use of filler/undeveloped cards such as Charlie @ 4* or Wanda @ 1* etc
3) The metagame shifts regularly as compared to older days (but i guess the current elo is getting stagnant with 3-4 clans being the obvious choices).
4) No random mode (I have doubts about this, I know normal matches were all set in random mode but was it also for ELO? Clarify this please)
5) Better ELO bans + Format election (power to the public)
6) Much bigger fan base = better players = better input = better output
7) Quick battle mode, making cheating in ELO much harder.
Cons -
1) Better-than-the-last-release mantra have driven most older cards/clans obsolete. for eg. the All Stars, with all the power creep(?) the only viable "fixed" choices are Saki, Robb Cr(?), Karen, Marina, Stacey/Jessie (does anybody pick anything else? even Randy gets no facetime these days). The same goes for the PCs with Clover, Diana, Lucy + 1 random other card becoming the norm.
TLDR : While the no. of cards and clans have grown exponentially, the case still remains the same - players will pick from the obvious chosen lot of 5-6 from the 20+ other cards in the clan. Mono-decks are a different story.
(contd...)
4/6
(...contd)
2) Olding ... Dafug? Rescue made me quit ELO ... ty
3) Losing the match just from a single round isn't what ELO is supposed to be (Even Jackie Cr couldn't get away with that). Please do not state Kolos, he never made that much of an impact on ELO, 1300+ with Kolos? I highly doubt it.
4) Revision of the current perma-banned cards is necessary for a few. For eg. Striker ain't much of a threat now that 14 life is the norm.
Luck, Skill, Cards/Deck -
Luck will always be a major factor but skill as always can turn your luck around.
Cards and decks ... hmmm, i feel that they are now as important as ever with the metagame revolving around certain cards/clans. If you do not draw a decent counter hands, it will be an uphill battle.
ps: If you had wanted detailed ELO comparisons over the course of UR, I apologise for just stating the comparisons between the current ELO and the ELO phase I have played the most, as UR has gone through several ELO formats however brief (weekly clan bans, weekly ability bans, No ban weeks etc) and stating each and every PROs and CONs would definitely take up much space and I feel the comparisons would then become a fiasco. So I believe comparing the ELO mode I have played the most with the current ELO mode would suffice.
2) Olding ... Dafug? Rescue made me quit ELO ... ty
3) Losing the match just from a single round isn't what ELO is supposed to be (Even Jackie Cr couldn't get away with that). Please do not state Kolos, he never made that much of an impact on ELO, 1300+ with Kolos? I highly doubt it.
4) Revision of the current perma-banned cards is necessary for a few. For eg. Striker ain't much of a threat now that 14 life is the norm.
Luck, Skill, Cards/Deck -
Luck will always be a major factor but skill as always can turn your luck around.
Cards and decks ... hmmm, i feel that they are now as important as ever with the metagame revolving around certain cards/clans. If you do not draw a decent counter hands, it will be an uphill battle.
ps: If you had wanted detailed ELO comparisons over the course of UR, I apologise for just stating the comparisons between the current ELO and the ELO phase I have played the most, as UR has gone through several ELO formats however brief (weekly clan bans, weekly ability bans, No ban weeks etc) and stating each and every PROs and CONs would definitely take up much space and I feel the comparisons would then become a fiasco. So I believe comparing the ELO mode I have played the most with the current ELO mode would suffice.
5/6
Start date: - Wednesday 27/05/09
Current Elo
PROs-
1) Wide variety of decks
2) Most clans are very competitive compared to just a few years ago
3) Weekly bans dont complete shut down clans anymore
CONs-
1) Too many games decided on first turn due to stronger 2* and 4-5*
2) Power creep and rendered most cards and even a few clans completely obsolete
3) Luck is an even bigger factor now since the life increase - explained below
My biggest issue with ELO and the main reason why i have almost completely stopped playing this game entirely is due to how much guess work plagues this game now. Since the increase to 14 life and the new releases of stronger 2* and 5* cards this game comes down to guessing whether the opponent is going to all in at the first turn or hold pills till 3 or 4 round. With the old system there was more room to read opponents and counter play since one round didnt decide the whole match. There are games now where if the enemy has Grudj, Avola, Greem, or some other huge nuke it becomes a 50/50 game of guessing whether its a bluff or all in. This is a big issue with this game right now and the numbers show it, ELO participation has dropped drastically these past months. I'm not entirely sure how this problem could be cured entirely but a good fix for the time being would to ban some of the stronger low star cards or tweak a few clans. In conclusion i still have hope that this game can be saved with some care and attention of the devs. Sry for wall of text :o
Current Elo
PROs-
1) Wide variety of decks
2) Most clans are very competitive compared to just a few years ago
3) Weekly bans dont complete shut down clans anymore
CONs-
1) Too many games decided on first turn due to stronger 2* and 4-5*
2) Power creep and rendered most cards and even a few clans completely obsolete
3) Luck is an even bigger factor now since the life increase - explained below
My biggest issue with ELO and the main reason why i have almost completely stopped playing this game entirely is due to how much guess work plagues this game now. Since the increase to 14 life and the new releases of stronger 2* and 5* cards this game comes down to guessing whether the opponent is going to all in at the first turn or hold pills till 3 or 4 round. With the old system there was more room to read opponents and counter play since one round didnt decide the whole match. There are games now where if the enemy has Grudj, Avola, Greem, or some other huge nuke it becomes a 50/50 game of guessing whether its a bluff or all in. This is a big issue with this game right now and the numbers show it, ELO participation has dropped drastically these past months. I'm not entirely sure how this problem could be cured entirely but a good fix for the time being would to ban some of the stronger low star cards or tweak a few clans. In conclusion i still have hope that this game can be saved with some care and attention of the devs. Sry for wall of text :o
6/6
05/11/09...not as old as some, but ELO is my main mode
Pro's of current ELO:
- Almost every clan is highly playable....only real exception is La Junta who sitll have a bit to go
- Weekly bans really smash down Overpowering clans but don't completely annihilate them (unlike the certain 8 or so card Roots ban week)
- No more potential KO from the second round (I find this a pro and realise why GHEIST used to be so ridiculously strong
- Even cheap, average decks can get to 1200+
Con's:
- Whilst every clan is useable...'staple' halfdecks are the only thing anyone ever uses
- Certain weeks unbans just create too much domination (eg: Askai)
- 2* strong support coupled with nukes has become the meta...30ld + nuke fury is a viable option
- Power AND ability creep. The best example is a used-to-be-wonderful card like Tula...now she is an honest liability in most situations
- Noob tactics and just packing nukes is one of the best ways to go
Luck/Skill/Cards and decks
Luck and skill must always be in the game...but as waster has pointed out...if you don't draw the appropriate counter against certain decks the game becomes almost unwinnable from round 1...I find an easy example is if you don't draw any SOA or DR...now the most key part of any deck
And thus luck in your cards drawn has become a significant part of the game
Pro's of current ELO:
- Almost every clan is highly playable....only real exception is La Junta who sitll have a bit to go
- Weekly bans really smash down Overpowering clans but don't completely annihilate them (unlike the certain 8 or so card Roots ban week)
- No more potential KO from the second round (I find this a pro and realise why GHEIST used to be so ridiculously strong
- Even cheap, average decks can get to 1200+
Con's:
- Whilst every clan is useable...'staple' halfdecks are the only thing anyone ever uses
- Certain weeks unbans just create too much domination (eg: Askai)
- 2* strong support coupled with nukes has become the meta...30ld + nuke fury is a viable option
- Power AND ability creep. The best example is a used-to-be-wonderful card like Tula...now she is an honest liability in most situations
- Noob tactics and just packing nukes is one of the best ways to go
Luck/Skill/Cards and decks
Luck and skill must always be in the game...but as waster has pointed out...if you don't draw the appropriate counter against certain decks the game becomes almost unwinnable from round 1...I find an easy example is if you don't draw any SOA or DR...now the most key part of any deck
And thus luck in your cards drawn has become a significant part of the game
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