12/79

ElitePow - Monday 21/11/2011, 22:46
Imperator - New VisioN

Pussycats need a serious boost - I don't remember seeing a single deck of those this week...
Other clans are eating their bread and butter with much better damage reduction coupled with much better bonuses
Even unbanning Yayoi might not save them.

13/79

0 Romane - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 13:29
Guru - FLiCKERS

The only thing i can think of being unbanned: Zatman

14/79

Trippie - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 14:29
Imperator - Open Casket

In my opinion, the ELO perma - ban list ONLY needs to contain cards which are overpowered, cause a complete guess from the opponent (thus removing any skill) and cards whose clans are overpowered (though these are always changing). Sorting through these from scratch, I came up with the following list:

OP Cards:

Big 5
Lamar Cr
Vickie Cr
Marco Cr
Alec Cr
Shakra
GraksmxxT
Copper
Hawk
Tanaereva Cr
Jackie Cr
Caelus Cr

Cards which often cause guessing:

Shann (SOA still means a 9/6)
Sylth (esp. with 14 life it can cause lots of guessing round one without SOA)
Smokey Cr (only SOA abilities work, even then with a low star count you could be controlling matchups)
Sigma (same as Sylth)
Gil (same as Sylth, but worse since you're likely to be defending first so it's even easier, plus SOA doesn't kill him like Sylth or Sigma)
Kolos (but I don't really think he's overpowered)

Cards which could possibly be banned due to OP clans (cards which will nearly always cause debate):

Ratanah / Lou
Marina / Striker / Robb Cr
Yayoi / Charlie
Kolos / Ghumbo / Oshitsune (yes Kolos is repeated because if he isn't part of list 2, he's definitely on this)
Sledg / Kerry
Spyke
Dorian / Zatman (though until they re-vamp DTs Zatman will remain banned)
Wee Lee
Rolph / Toro / Draheera
Dalhia / Selma / Bonnie Ld
Bogdan / Olga
Emeth
Uranus

Really all these cards in the third list are on the verge of being overpowered, it all depends on new releases and which clans can really dominate so it becomes a toss-up.

15/79

Trippie - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 15:19
Imperator - Open Casket

Missed out Rowdy / Qubik in my 3rd list

16/79

LB_Abnormal - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 16:05
Titan

I agree with almost everything you say there trippie. Your logic is sound for just about every card....except for your third list. I have a problem with:

Kolos
Wee Lee

When was the last time you legitimately saw more than 1 or 2 odd ulu watu decks? the poor clan is defunct. Noobody plays them because their low star cards are just so awful. And wee lee is barely overpowered anyway. I think he should be unbanned. Maybe I'm digging my own grave but so be it.

As for Kolos, sure, he's counterable. Blah blah blah, drs, soa abilities. BUT. You're in turn 1, you go first. You have no soa ability, and only 1 dr. What do you do? you can throw out your dr, but you know he probably will just chump it. You can throw out a card with enough pillz to beat a furied kolos, and you can potentially be left with 2 pillz left, which is an insta-loss. Or you can bluff. Either way, he causes an INCREDIBLY unfair situation just by being present on the board. Nobody should have to coin flip for a win/loss situation every turn. EVER. Especially in ELO

17/79

Talvisota - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 16:38
Senior

I think that Kolos shouldn't be unbanned. Nightmare will be overpowered!!!

18/79

Trippie - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 16:50
Imperator - Open Casket

That's why I left the third list to opinion and debate, because it becomes almost impossible to categorize those cards into either of the first 2 batches. Really, they are dependent on each other to be OP or not-OP. For example, Emeth suddenly looks like a beast of a card when you have Nightmare dominating everything but when GHEIST is there he is just average.

Kolos almost certainly ensures only 2 rounds to win, which is probably why he's too OP. But I think you're forgetting he can't KO you in ELO without another clan member since it's 14 life.

On the Wee Lee topic I think he definitely deserves some play time, since Ulu Watu barely have a playable half at the moment. It really comes down to whether you want to ban him because he himself is insane or unban him because Ulu Watu aren't so insane.

To be more clear:

- The first list is just cards which will 99% never be allowed back into ELO.
- The second list are those cards which are OP since they remove skill from the game.
- The third list are those which aren't in list 1 or list 2 but could be banned / unbanned in the future depending on which clans are strong - dependent on the metagame / future releases.

19/79

{OC} Light - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 17:12
Hero

Putting Bogdan / Olga onto any permanant ban ruins Freaks completely until there's a new release.

Generally a Freaks half-deck will consist of Olga, Bogdan, Esmeralda and a card of your choice which can be Wolfgang, Akendrum, Hula, Magda, Mira ... so on. Take Olga or Bogdan out and you kill any kind of decent Freaks halfdeck.

The problem with Freaks now is that beyond Olga and Bogdan, there aren't any very stable card choices. Yes, you can have Wolfgang, Esmeralda, Hula, Akendrum etc. etc., but they don't win games like Bogdan and Olga do.

I understand that Olga and Bogdan have really above the bar stats, but please don't look at the individual card only. Bogdan and Olga are only worth using in a Freaks halfdeck, which pretty much lacks anything that is even barely comparable to them.

Other power reducers like Boris, Magda and Maiej can't compare to Olga and Olga Noel isn't as strong as her either.

Bogdan is pretty much irreplacable, and Freaks lack SOB already. Now you take away their only SOA?

20/79

Vinyl-Scratch - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 18:41
Titan - D-Versified

@Trippie good list. Don't think lamar cr is overpowered. He was but since cards have slowly been getting stronger, he is balanced. Smokey cr isn't overpowered and only causes guessing if you see him as a threat, which most of the time he wouldn't be. Not so sure about the third list.

@Ab agree about wee lee.

Not so sure about kolos, he can't 1hko in elo anymore which was the main reason why he was banned. There is now no reason to nearly full pill against a kolos bluff as 12 damage wouldn't finish you.

21/79

RG LoA - Tuesday 22/11/2011, 19:31
Titan - Legends of America

Another thing that needs considering is not whether a certain card is overpowered, but will having that card available cause that clan to dominate the scene. I think this was mostly true for Smokey in that if you were not playing Piranas you were at a disadvantage. Banning him meant more diversity in what was seen.