We'd like to discuss the ELO system with you.
Over time, this particular game mode has undergone several changes that have largely proved to be successful. So this is where we are currently at:
- We’ve reached the point where there are almost 1,000 cards available in the format and in which "optimized" decks exist by mixing up clans. It would seem that "historic" cards (ones that are several years’ old) have an unchallenged place in decks that work well in ELO and, as a result, are greatly limiting the emergence of new deck types.
- The format has dramatically improved with the arrival of new clans and particularly new cards which mean that decks can be significantly improved (it is now possible to produce a proficient deck from each clan). By this, we’re not referring to stomp decks used to race to the top of the rankings, but rather to decks that work well in the ELO mode.
- More effective cards per clan also means greater possibilities of monoclan domination.
Our current aim is to give the ELO mode room to expand and evolve by adding a criterion to staff bans.
So this is what we propose to breathe new life into the ELO mode:
The age of cards will become an important factor in what we decide to ban from the ELO mode. The older a card is, the more it runs the risk of being banned. This will enable us to dislodge certain cards that have become fixtures in ELO decks and, in doing so, make way for new cards to emerge.
We will select between 0 and 4 cards per clan (at each wave of bans) which we can ban based on this criterion.
For example, let’s take a look at an All Stars deck that is currently very effective in ELO. Marina (2007), Jessie (2008 ) and Randy (2008 ) very often have a place in their star category. If we ban Marina and Randy, Nathan might find his place or would at least have the chance of doing so. In the same way, the presence of Uranus partly prevents the creation of a new reducer for the Sakrohm clan because of his dominance. Several cards may not seem worth considering because of their direct competition within the clan. However, we believe they could provide interesting alternatives (I'm thinking here of Leviatonn VS Klawz or Stalfhaust).
This new criterion of play would allow us to better manage the game's evolution. We would fix dates for new bans every X months, of course taking the time to first discuss this with the community, as we did with the last wave of bans.
Banned "historic" cards would then be definitively expelled from the ELO mode.
In short this new system would allow us to:
- Refresh the ELO mode on a regular basis by providing genuine renewal to the metagame.
- Give new character cards a chance to make their mark on the game mode.
- Allow new deck types to emerge by combining the various clans without having to play/challenge certain unavoidable cards (by getting rid of “historic” cards, players would have more scope for creativity).
- Reduce the power of monoclans in the game mode.
Initially, each clan would not be affected in the same way but over time a real change in the mode’s playstyle could emerge.
Ultimately we feel these suggested changes will provide ELO devotees with yet more scope for discovery and enjoyment.
These are our proposals. We very much look forward to hearing any comments or suggestions you may have on them.
edited by Espectroscuro monday 23/09/2013, 16:32
In one word: No.
The current meta decks that I have noticed (and repetitively lost to) have always been due to cards that do too much for too few stars or are just plain out broken. These cards need to be banned and replaced with alternative cards. Replacing staples from time to time is understandable, but plain out banning a balanced card due to age is unfair. Additionally, the new replacement cards you have given clans usually fall into one of two categories: under powered or over powered.
A good example of this is Hurrican into elo. I have yet to win a single match up against them due to problematic cards they possess. The new cards outclass your old ones so well that building a deck with an actual strategy, rather than a motley crew of over powered new cards is a waste. What needs to be done more than anything else is an overhaul on game balance and a harmony between old and new cards.
Once game balance has been restored, you can focus on making new and interesting cards that replace and or add options to old cards that have been dominating the ELO scene for years. A good example within the past year would be Hriger. This one card challenged the 4 star spot held by Methane for years. Hriger provided a solid second option for a Gheist 4* and has proven to be a balanced addition to ELO game play.
In conclusion, while making money is your goal, customer satisfaction is what keeps people playing this game. With the points above, I hope you take them into consideration.
My opinion is that they should first try and deal with some of the still unresolved problems before heading into yet a new thing (like the glitch with the ability of Noctezuma, for example). On-topic, even if I'm not that much into ELO, it seems to me that it is both a good and a bad idea. The good part is that it would make the mode more welcoming for new cards, and by banning some of the staples, make room for cards that would otherwise see no play due to competition in their clan. Bad part is that, eliminating cards just because they're old would affect veteran cards price-wise. Moreover, as someone else said here, some people may have to work hard to get some of those cards that were mentioned (Marina, Leviatonn etc.) and if those get banned, they worked for nothing. Plus, turning ELO into this more-or-less "Standard" mode would benefit the new cards and hurt the older ones ... which is bad enough already, but which also leads to the idea that they're doing this just to further pump up the Huracan for money-draining purposes.
What options we have?
1) Forbid the use of too powerful characters (aka ban)
2) Limit the benefits of using such characters (penalty)
3) Redo the cards themselves
4) Something else. (new game modes etc)
5) Ignore the problem completely (lol. Live with it!)
My sentiment is that 1) is good for gamebreaking cards (Jackie Cr being poster child) and 2) is the balancing tool between strong but not OP cards.
Someone earlier said penalty would break ELO like people bash DT with totally absurd penalty cards, but DT has no bans so extremely poweful cards can be used to get wins, in ELO balance is better because of staff bans and anyone can play "seriously" with the penalty cards too, the progress is just slower and the fails are penalized harsher. So there would not be absurd troll-hands in ELO like there are in DT, just strong hands by people who do missions (and this can be avoided by not making ELO related missions in LD's.)
Oh. And give positive incentive too. If you play ELO with deck that has no penalty cards at all your score counts towards DT too. You miss this thing, so it could be reward for conforming gentleman play
Elo solution is always ban cards, do you really think this is the best solution? i dont think so, just give to the cards elo points.
¿what means elo points? look this images:
imagine that all the players begins with 1000 elo points and they must do a deck usin only the 1000 elo points and the 25 stars.
What we obtain with this?
1- we can use all the cards ( obviusly no the permanently banned characters)
2 -That in the same deck could not exist nevermore of 2 good cards and only 1 very good card since if you want to put Rolph and Striker in the same deck (and I base on the images) you cant because Rolph is 500 points and Striker 450 if the limit are 1000 - 950 (sum of Rolph and Striker) only remaining 50 available points.
3- A level 80 and one level 15 are in equality of conditions
4- More strategy since beside squaring 25 stars you have to do it without overcomes 1000 elo points, therefore variety of strategies
5-We give more use to all the cards
Doubts that you can arise from this idea. Because 1000 points elo?to give sense to the value 1000 with which it is begin elo,
can you put an example of deck? Http: // img828.imageshack.us/img828/3645/totalelo.png. 2 stars are absent but there are no more cards where to choose with the images that I have put of example
Darko, I see where you are going and that could work.
Not all cards needs ELO cost at all (50% of this games cards could be free to play at ELO, or even have negative cost if you accept them in your deck.) - So if we have 1000 points pool then Jackie Cr could be 800 points and Oxen 200 points and thats when you cant accomodate more "elo cost" cards to your deck. If the prices are well planned then this could work.
After running month of this system you could review if some cards are over-used (so they are really underpriced) and adjust their prices until finding a sweetspot.
In all seriousness, I'm fine with the proposal, except for the 0-4 cards per clan part. You guys will release new cards every two weeks, there's no stopping that. And you guys are often stuck between a rock and a hard place when it comes to creating the stats on a new card, because a) you want the card to be powerful so that people will want to buy credits to obtain the card, but b) you don't want it to be too powerful or else you will ruin the gameplay (aka spyke, kalindra, huracan). And sometimes old cards need to be banned to make way for the new cards, for example you guys want to release a new sakrohm 3* dr but it will never be as good as Uranus (otherwise it will be op). Fine, ban Uranus and release the new sak dr. Just don't get too crazy with the bans please. 0-4 cards per clan?? It should be more like 0-1, with 0 being the case the majority of the time. The only clan that you should be banning 4 cards from is huracan.
DarKo's idea is kinda cool.
As for the original topic of the thread: No.
Why ban because of age? Stick to banning the pointlessly overpowered cards, please.
What (WP) Ace said was correct.
This is like saying "Let's ban Gary because he's old but leave Noctezuma alone in the already overpowered Huracan clan because he's one of the newest releases."
But if the ELO point thing DarKo suggested is comes out and is done properly, that would be really cool.