Sorry for being late to ask the EN community, but we'd like to ask you a question about the future of Rebirth cards. My opinion is that they are currently not 'good' for the game, especially for the Collectors ones... but I personally love their illustrations, so simply deleting those seems impossible to us. So it's really a difficult decision. We'd like to ask you: what would you prefer we do?
Here are 3 'solutions', please feel free to talk here about it and vote for whichever you like the most.
Have a nice weekend!
The poll will be live starting at 11AM. [editor's note: the poll appears to be live now]
edited by Xonia saturday 10/12/2016, 11:48
I don't get the Rb hate.... I think they are fine. The old artwork on some of those cards was problematic and/or demeaning to the quality of the game...
I own 54 of the Rbs (Missing Platoona RB, Lihoi Chun Rb and the yet unreleased Pino Rb) and all 57 of their originals, one of each only, all full XP. I'm not a market manipulator, I'm just a collector. Thinking about it, I probably overpaid for Striker and Vermin N last week.
The artwork replacement needs to happen, I think that's a given, for the benefit of the game, that's why I like "option 3" just fine... "Option 2" is definitely my favorite... It makes a ton of sense to make the crazy amount of unplayable cards suddenly playable, even if most of them won't be as good as existing ones. It would quickly create more options for deck creation.
The compensation idea for the removal of the Rb's in "Option 1" is very problematic. The whole "Rebirth" situation was a roller coaster ride from the start, with rumors and opinions affecting the market value of those cards and their original versions... I'll bet a lot of people lost money on this already, and the market effects could be really crazy and cause more harm than good... The vote shows that "Option 1" won, but that is still only 45% of the votes cast...
I guess we just have to wait and see what the staff decides to do...
BTW: When do we get a free shot at Kommandon Ld and Nega D Ld? It's been 11 months...
Infiniti - I don't feel you really answered or addressed many of my questions. You did get a few, though. I also want to be clear that I like when people challenge me. I'm not upset at you whatsoever. Dialog is important for understanding. I see this as two equals trying to talk. You seem to be treating me like a newb to the game, though.
I never expected a handout, and I've worked hard, just like you, to get what I have. I have a 0xp and I want another one. I already worked to get it. Since I currently own 1 of every card at every level, aside from NBs, Crs, etc. I clearly have no market experience, right? I'm not new at this, so using the 3* Vermyn N example is merely meant to distract from the fact there is a difference in prices, which you never addressed, and only said I could talk to you about it. A 3* could also be bought at 2*, but not vice versa. I've watched Vermyn N, specifically, for months. His 0xp may not be 150k, but if no one is offering anything else, then I can't get it for less. That's reality. I've always had to pay more to get my 0xps. Maybe not 50k more, but more. Sometimes 5-10k for pricey rates with semi-evos. I'm sure you know that. Will that be taken into consideration? That seems fair, not a handout, and not being lazy. UR is taking from us, so why should I do more legwork for them to help them take stuff from me that I already worked for? It's like the repo guy asking me to carry my stuff out to his truck.
The berserkgirl and berserkgirl Cr example is also a ludicrous one. They're different card with different stats. Rbs are the exact same card, only different artwork. What I bought was a card for a clan with certain stats. Giving me the exact same card is not unreasonable. Rbs are special, so pretending it's a "whole different card I'm asking for, simply because there's no Rb in the name" doesn't work. The definition of Rb is that it's the same card with a different skin, isn't it? That's why it's not a Cr. A better argument against me would have been that since I collect art, I paid for the art, not the stats.
Now the market issue you brought up is clearly a problem. Getting 25k per sounds nice, but if my 100 were all 0xp and worth a bit more, then trading in actually lost me money, didn't it? Just because it's a large number doesn't make it good. Gotta look in context. If they're worth 90k instead of 85, then I lost 5k each on those I already owned. Additionally, I lose the previous exclusivity of the card I had. Crs go up more because they're not in packs. Now I have pack cards. This doesn't address that now they could become Crs, though. A valid worry.
Those I was planning to trade up on? Now everyone has a ton more Vermyn N. They won't be worth 85k after, because in the card only scenario, there will be a huge influx of cards. This makes Vermyn N more accessible, which means I'm advocating for getting less money, not more, if cards are given as an option. Your conclusion is backwards. In money only, again, you'd now buy more of Vermyn N, and prices would go up even more for that card, further making it difficult to obtain. It's opposite directions for the card in our scenarios. Is it better to make Vermyn N accessible to new players, or not? Choosing money hurts new players. It reduces supply and increases demand of those Rbs. Choosing cards does not. It increases supply and lowers demand, which lowers prices.
I hope you respond so we can continue to talk about this. It needs to be before the final decision is made.
And I resent being called lazy or greedy, particularly when your suggestion is the one more likely to gain more profit.
edited by Xonia wednesday 14/12/2016, 02:01
Personally, I'm not a big fan of "erase/compensate with clintz" because I mainly got my Rbs through purchasing packs. I rarely sell/trade on the market, so giving me clintz as compensation is pretty worthless. I spent 500+ credits on the Rebirth special packs when it was released, and I purposefully hunted Rbs in Armageddon packs when I could've saved credits and just bought New Bloods if Rbs never existed. But I'm probably in the minority.
Xonia, if I understood correctly, some of the stuff in Infiniti's comment was directed at you, but a lot of it was less specific and meant to address general complaints about the way RBs are being handled... I think the implications are that:
1) RB compensation is likely to be relatively fair... There's no way to make it "absolutely" fair for everybody, as this is an issue the community lacks a strong consensus on.
2) People who are focused on the short-term thing (clintz in their virtual pocket) rather than the long-term thing (smooth transition form RB current to RB future which does more good than harm for the game) are ultimately not doing themselves any favors.
That said, it's a really delicate issue...
In my personal opinion, removing RBs entirely is far from the best option. I can see it eliminating some confusion among new players and the like, however:
-We could have playable stats and a snippet of new story for each RB, and thus give them a concrete role in UR's economy, and allow them to become strong purchase motivators. It's not as hard as all that to achieve, either. I'll use Yumi as an example (even though her art is honestly great.)
New potential stats:
7/2 Confidence +14 atk OR
7/2 Reprisal +12 atk OR
7/3 Confidence +8 atk
(none of these make her an auto-include in modern decks, but they all make her an interesting option.)
To her description, we can add something like "After 40 years of non-stop training, Yumi has finally mastered the long-lost Quivering Ramen Strike technique. Now she seeks to regain her former glory as one of the city's competitive fighters!"
And there we are, a balanced, further "evolved," interesting version of the RB that gives players a lot of motivation aside from art to invest in her. This option requires some work but could make Boostr some money.
-We could ban "old" versions of RB cards from any kind of non-event play, effectively taking them out of the vast majority of the game, while at the same time, allowing players to keep them for sentimental AND collection value. I believe this would also satisfy the majority of UR players, and require far, far less work, while having no immediate and complicated effects on the market.
I think both of those solutions are better than what ended up in the vote. Regardless, I'm happy that a decision was made with the wants of the players in mind. I would love to see surveys like this (perhaps with more preliminary discussion to discover the best options) take place.
Ghelas - You're definitely right. This is less than ideal, and it won't be fair for everyone. That's impossible.
I'd just prefer to not have a "batch" return if it's at all possible. I'm not asking for a personalized, to your door, thing. My first post was that we should have 2 options instead of 1. Clintz or cards. And I think, though of course I don't know, that's a bit more effort for a (slightly) happier and smoother process for much more players.
If UR Admins simply don't have the time, and only 1 thing can be done, I'd still advocate cards over money for the above reasons.
Either way, I loved that it was a poll, too. I'm just here trying to lobby for a slightly better end result, that I also am being honest about the fact it happens to benefit me, too, out of full disclosure.